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Vaccination debate. Lock Rss

My intention is not to have a go at those who choose to or not to vaccinate but to bring to the table some information that may be new to you. My personal choice is not to vaccinate but this was only after researching the topic for 8 years. My knowledge on this topic has been through enormous research. I encourage you to do the same if this interests you or if you have been wondering about the safety of vaccinations. The original reason I studied it was after seeing a close friend have a perfectly normal and healthy child go from reaching every mile stone and beyond to becoming a vegetable after a 12mth vaccination. Again recently I know of someone who had a young baby die within 24hrs of the flu vaccination which has led me to want to share some of my knowledge with you and your precious family.


Ever wondered what is in a vaccine?
To name just a few and some of their known side effects.
Phenoxyethanol/Phenol
used as antifreeze. toxic to all cells and capable of disabling the immune system's response mechanism.
Neomycin sulfate
Interferes with Vit B absorption. An error in the uptake of B6 can cause rare form of epilepsy and mental retardation. Allergic reactions can be mild to life threatening.
Mercury /Thimerosal
One of the most poisonous substances known. Has an affinity for the brain, gut, liver, bone marrow and kidneys. Minute amounts can cause nerve damage. Symptoms of mercury toxicity are similar to those of autism.

Formaldehyde (formalin)
Major constituent of embalming fluid; poisonous if ingested; probable carinogen; suspected gastrointestinal, liver, immune system, nerve repoductive system and respiratory poison. Linked to leukemia, brain, colon, and lymphatic cancer.

Latex rubber
Can cause life threatening allergic reaction.

Beta-propiolactone
Known to cause cancer. Suspected gastrointestinal, liver, respiratory, skin and sense organ poison.

Alumimum
Implicated as a cause of brain damage suspected factor in Alzlleimers disease, dementia, seizures and comas.

There are plenty of Dr’s out there who once thought that vaccinations were the answer but who have since seen the side effects and studied it for themselves are realised the truth. To name a couple, Dr Viere Scheibner, Dr Peter Baratosy (SA Australia) and Dr Robert Mendelsohn.
Dr Mendelsohn has a great book out called ‘Confessions of a Medical Heretic’
Also some studies that Dr Scheibner has been involved in includes cot monitors to monitor breathing on babies before and after vaccinations. One of their findings was that cot death or SIDS as they deaths would have been put down to, were just after the DPT or other vaccinations.


HERD IMMUNITY
According to Dr’s we are told that to get rid of a disease we need to vaccinate EVERYONE so that we have the ‘herd immunity’ effect. So why is it then that the kids that are vaccinated against a disease, whooping cough for example, is it that they can still get it, and quiet often get it worse than the non-vaccinated kids? If vaccination actually worked you simply should not get it. No ifs or buts, you just should not get it. And as for Dr’s saying that by not vaccinating your child you are only protected by the kids who are vaccinated then once again why is it that the vaccinated kids are still passing it on and getting it in the first place and in the cases i have seen the vaccinated kids get it worse and it hangs around them for longer.

HEP B
Have you ever asked your self how your child can get Hep B?
They can get it if the Mother has it ans she passes it on.
If they have sex with a person who has it.
If they share a dirty needle with a person who has it.
So knowing this, how likely is your baby going to be incontact with it. Not to mention if you child did get it, you can cure it naturally anyway. So once again if herd immunisation was going to get rid of Hep B all together why does it not 100% protect your child against Hep B, why do they keep on needing boosters all their life? Why inject those possibly harmful ingredients into your healthy child?

Tetanus
Although this is not technically a vaccination I thought I would cover it.
Did you know it is still one of the few that contains mercury?
Did you know that you can rid the body of tetanus simply and easily by high amounts of Vit C and the only side effect you will have is diarrhea. The best way to ensure that it does not get to this is use something like hydrogen peroxide on the cut straight away and ensure you keep the cut clean and sterilised.

So your Dr told you that you will not get your bonus if you don’t vaccinate your child, or they can’t go to certain child cares or schools? Incorrect. To still get the payment you just have to fill out a form which ALL dr’s have in their drawers, it is a statutory declaration to say that you do not want to take the risks involved with vaccination. No school or childcare can stop your child from attending but they may say if their is outbreaks of certain sickness your child cannot attend for a period of time.

You are still wondering why Dr’s are telling us that vaccinations are safe and the cry your baby will feel for the duration of the jab is all worth it with very little side effects. You are still wondering why there is no connection between the epidemic of SIDS, Autism, eczema, learning difficulties, ADHD and the list goes on. The multi billion dollar government companies that are making these vaccinations are the ones doing the research on their vaccinations and you think they are going to make a connection and shoot themselves in the foot? If vaccinations were so safe they would make them compulsory but to do that they would need to be insured, that will never happen because insurance companies are smart enough to do their homework and they will never insure something that they will lose money on. You just have to ask yourself why when you were a child did you only get about 5 or less jabs, and now there is 50 or so and so many all in one. Imagine you having to get sick with multiple diseases at once and trying to cope with all the heavy metals that are in the vaccinations while still trying to develop and we wonder why these poor kids are suffering.

For those of you who still worry and want to feel like you have vaccinated but dont want to give your child all the nasty things in the vaccinations you can do the homepathic type although i personally would prefer my child get things as they come along and deal with them at the time. If feed your child on a healthy diet then there is no reason why your child should not fight the diseases.


There is so much to cover on this subject that this is only the tip of the iceberg. I am happy to answer other questions as they come up but I hope this has opened some eyes so you understand a little more on this hot debate. I wish you the best in health and happiness.

Here is some websites you may like to find out more
www.visainfo.org.au
www.avn.org.au
www.vaccination.inoz.com
www.nvic.org
www.ias.org.nz
www.vaccines.net
www.vaccineinfo.net
www.whale.to
www.judicialwatch.org

Hi, I don't want to start argument with you as you have done your research etc... and I don't have your extensive knowledge on the subject, but I'm one of those parents who would prefer to vaccinate, as I wouldn't want either of my babies to get something that I could have helped protect them from, then look back and go "well I could have possibly helped you," sort of like putting your safety belt on when you get in a car, it could possibly help you but no guarantees, I would rather protect my babies in every way possible!! And I'm sorry to say but a healthy diet is not going to protect your kids from everything, that is a very broad statement, that isn't really based on fact, surely?

Like with everything parenting based this is a decision only a parent can make about their own child, and I don't think scaring people into thinking vaccinating is all bad, as there are plenty, in fact the majority of cases, where the infants or children have been perfectly fine. Good Luck smile
PS If vaccines are so bad why do Drs still choose to immunise their own kids??
Hi Jana1,
Thanks for your input. I certainly dont make people feel bad for vaccinating, or try to scare people into not doing it, I make that quiet clear in my opening statement.
The Dr's are the ones who try to scare us non vacc parents into doing it, i am just giving some unknown info to those who want it, so anyone can take or leave this info. personal choice as is it is to vaccinate.
As far as Dr's vaccinating their own kids, you made a statement you can't back. I have 3 very close friends for Dr's. Only 1 would vacc her kids and even then she actually does them spaced out, not all in one and only selected ones. They have all seen side effects and for that reason make their choices accordingly. I am sure there are plenty of Dr's who do vacc. I can't answer for all of them.
I also have a close friend who is a chiro (mainly treats babies to 12 yrs) and he too has seen side effect after side effect from perfectly normal children to a sudden change after some vacc's. Like one just the other day was rolling over and doing all things a baby should and then within a day of its vax it suddenly does nothing, its face is blank, it wont roll over, wont hold its head up etc etc.
But if someone would rather the possibility of their child having that reaction or letting their child get something like the chicken pox well thats a choice you have to make.
Not trying to scare anyone, just putting the facts in writing.

I am by no means saying ALL children will react badly, but the one of the reasons some will and some wont is the same reason that one person will be drunk after 2 drinks and another takes an entire bottle of spirits. All humans are different weight, have different health and immune levels and react to different things differently.

We as humans were all created to have immunity to sickness and fight sickness ourselves. Health does play a vital role in your immunity. All too many parents are feeding their kids with unhealthy choices that are lowering their immune system. Like sugar, it can suppress your immune system and impair your defenses against infectious disease. Just one example of what I mean by being healthy and fighting disease yourself.
Once again, I am not having a go at anyone choosing to vacc, this article is for those who ask themselves if vacc is for them or not.
smile
what are the statistics?

what are the statistics for deaths after vaccination?

what are the statistics for permanant illness after vaccination?

what are the statistics for deaths caused by disease from no vaccination?

what are the statistics for permanant illness from no vaccination?

what are the statistics for perfectly healthy children after vaccination?

what are the statistics for perfectly healthy childen after no vaccination?

i think that would help put it in to perspective as to what is the best way to go as far as vaccination.

i choose to vaccinate but if i was given some strong statistics to proove that non vaccination is the safer option then i would think about re-considering my decision on vaccinate.

as everyone states......i am not trying to cause an argument.
this is just my opinion
[Edited on 02/05/2009]

Hi again,
You choose chicken pox as an example there and I thought I should tell you my husbands experience with chicken pox. He got them at 25, they hit him let a brick and just about killed, he was hospitalised and took over 3 weeks to recover, and to tell you the truth how he went on to have kids nobody really knows as it can make you infertile, and he had an extremely bad dose. In New Zealand (where I live), we are not rountinely vaccinated for chicken pox, and I for 1 who hasn't had chicken pox, would have been horrified to get this diease while pregnant, but luckily enough (as it went round my DD daycare, probably 3 times in the short period of my pregancy) I didn't get it and neither did DD, as I chose to pull her out each time it appeared.
I agree with megrad, if there were more statistics against vaccinating I wouldn't do it, (I didn't get the menzB 1 when it was available for DD, as the stats weren't good at all!!!), but as it stands I will continue to vax my kids (not that I('m having anymore).
And to your friends who have had these horrible experiences my heart goes out to them, but they are the exceptions not the rule.
Thanks smile
Hi Jana1, Just would like to say that i am not going to vax my child from chicken pox at 18moths, Toddlers are still developing so quickly! Chickenpox is a "Childhood Disease" everyone our age had them as kids, if my child did not contract it before the age of 14. The next aust vax schedule is to be done from 10-14yrs to have a vax then to outway the possible pain your husband went through. would't you see that as a safer option for your child, when his brain and body arn't developing as much as it was and two??? Or evan better for his to catch it and let his bodies immune system natualy fight it like we did?
Hi, We are NOT offered the chicken pox vaccine in New Zealand, we can pay for it, but it costs about $500. I got that checked out as I haven't had chicken pox and I was worried about getting it when I pregnant with DS, as DD was exposed rather frequently, and yes I would have got it done, if it had been more affordable.
Chicken pox isn't really a disease which concerns me now anyway, if I get it, if my kids get it, well they get it (it concerned while pregnant), life goes on.
I'm a hell of a lot more worried about the really mean diseases ie: Menzb (which as I put in my other post, I didn't vax DD for, the vaccine was not extensively tested, and was shown to have some adverse effects.), pneumococcal (which is the major cause for not just meningitis, but ear infections, pneumonia and a whole host of other nasties, and yes I vaxed my DS for this wasn't available to DD, other than at a cost $130 per dose!!!) just to name a couple.
And yes there are pro and cons for everything, what alot of people have got to remember (especially those who choose not to vaccinate), children used to die of these dieases, with recovery there was often disbalilties, have you every met some of those kids ravaged by some of these dieases, well they are the lucky ones, apparently, and like all things I do for my babies I try to protect them as much as I can.
There are no certainties in life, other than death, horrible thought really.

Taken from the first post ( sorry I don't know how to copy it probably)
HEP B
Have you ever asked your self how your child can get Hep B?
They can get it if the Mother has it ans she passes it on.
If they have sex with a person who has it.
If they share a dirty needle with a person who has it.
So knowing this, how likely is your baby going to be incontact with it. Not to mention if you child did get it, you can cure it naturally anyway. So once again if herd immunisation was going to get rid of Hep B all together why does it not 100% protect your child against Hep B, why do they keep on needing boosters all their life? Why inject those possibly harmful ingredients into your healthy child?

Copied from the Immunisation Advisory Centre website


Immunisation for hepatitis B is given either as one injection or in combination with diphtheria, tetanus, whooping cough and Haemophilus influenzae type b.



Babies, children and adults are all at risk of catching hepatitis B as the virus is passed on from mother to baby through the blood stream, and through transfer of blood (e.g. cuts, school sores) and sexual activity.



How good is the protection offered by this vaccine?
About 95% of children show a good response to three doses of the vaccine. It is better to immunise for hepatitis B at a younger age as the response in people over the age of 40 is not as effective.


What about side effects?
Immunisation for hepatitis B is very safe. Some people get redness and soreness at the site of injection. Some people get diarrhoea or feel unwell for a short time.


About Hepatitis B
Hepatitis B is the second biggest preventable cause of cancer in the world. This is the first anti-cancer vaccine.

Hepatitis B is a serious disease caused by a virus that attacks the liver. Hepatitis B can be passed on to others (by blood or unprotected sex). Babies can catch Hepatitis B from their mothers before or during the birth. Children can catch Hepatitis B at school and in playgrounds. This probably occurs in the playground, from cuts and grazes, or from contact with skin infections such as school sores.

Hepatitis B can cause lifelong infection, cirrhosis (scarring) of the liver, liver cancer, liver failure, and death. Children who catch Hepatitis B tend to be less ill initially than adults who catch it, but get more long term problems later in life.



[Edited on 03/05/2009]
[quote][b]Posted by:[/b] limelight My intention is not to have a go at those who choose to or not to vaccinate but to bring to the table some information that may be new to you. i know you have good intentions but you have titled this thread as "vaccination debate" your just asking for people to get defensive and cause a debate i am pretty sure we have all seen the numerous threads about vaccinations and are all pretty well educated enough to make our own decision. we all understand that good and bad can come from not vaccinating, and good and bad can come from vaccinating. there is no right or wrong decision when it comes to this topic.

I think that this is an interesting topic. I agree that good and bad things can come from vaccinations, but how can you tell if it is going to happen to your child, you just have to take that chance if you choose to have your children vaccinated. I think that the one size fits all approach with vaccinations is wrong, but the sixty four thousand dollar question is how do you remedy that? Could a test be made to determine what children will have a reaction or won't?

However, this could be from left field, but it was a thought I had, how much do we as mothers have to do with any adverse reactions to immunizations? While pregnant we expose our babies, not willingly mind you, to a chemical cocktail, from the air we breathe, to the moisturisers and make-up we put on our skin, to the food we eat etc. All of this is being passed onto our forming babies,(like we don't already have enough guilt!!) These chemicals must be in our babies bodies, and how much of that then affects the babies when it comes to immunizations and what is being put into their bodies then.

I will immunize as I think that it is beneficial, although it is a question I think about a lot, especially as my DS goes in for his 6 month needles this week. I am interested in the homeopathic immunizations, and if anyone has info/websites on that I would be interested in reading it.
my dd's are NOT vaxxed for medical reasons but even if they could have them i dont think i would my dp and i were reading into it the other day and i cant remember the site but it stated that there were no recorded cases of sids untill mass vaxination started also that death rates were lower in third world countries untill they started vaxxing them now way would i inject MY child with any of that crap

my 3 babies ds4 dd1-3 and dd2-1

To say that there was no reported cases of SIDS is not correct. You are trying to say that there is no unknown causes of death in infants. SIDS was not the term used way back then but I am sure that there were cases.

Of course there were cases of it, just like there never used to be cancer!! Yeah right, it just wasn't called cancer, they were just unexplained deaths or the y were called stupid things like, death caused by bad blood, or something equally vague.
Sorry this topic, annoys me abit as there are some many different takes on it, and it just depends on which side of the fence you fall on.
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