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Is it meant to be this hard? Lock Rss

I must have hit a nerve with this one!!??

Ok Ok, point taken, maybe 'abandon' was a bad choice of words, and I appoligise for offending anyone. It was just a bit alarming to hear that some of you actually admitted to yelling 'shut up' in your babies faces. I would have thought that this would have sent alarm bells ringing.

Firstly YES I DO HAVE KIDS (the youngest being 2 months) and YES! To me they are PERFECT LITTLE ANGELS. But they cry like all babies, i just would NEVER leave them to cry on their own.

Like you I'm intitled to an opinion and was in no way criticising any mother for the way they handle their babies cries. My opinion just happens to be different to the majority of people in this thread.

But have you ever wondered what this 'leaving your baby to cry does to your babies?
Training your baby to sleep, and sleep school all seem a bit to harsh to me.

Dr. Paul M. Fleiss and Frederick Hodges in Sweet Dreams: A Pediatrician's Secrets for Baby's Good Night's Sleep Lowell House, 2000) have this to say about such training programs for babies:

“A child cannot comprehend why you are ignoring his cries for help. Ignoring your baby's cries, even with the best of intentions, may lead him to feel that he has been abandoned (that word again). Babies are responding to biological needs that sleep 'experts' either ignore or deny. It is true that a baby whose crying is ignored may eventually fall back asleep, but the problem that caused the night waking in the first place has remain unsolved.

“The most sensible and compassionate approach is to respond immediately to your child's cries. Remind yourself that you are the parent, and that giving your baby reassurance is one of the joyous responsibilities of being a parent. It is a beautiful feeling knowing that you alone have the power to brighten your child's life and banish fear and sorrow.”

Margot Sunderland, who runs a conference and lecture organisation called the Centre for Child Mental Health in London, said that stress levels in babies who aren't comforted when they cry can get high enough, and remain high for so long, that it causes brain cells to die. That in turn can lead to neurosis and emotional disorders later in life, she says.

Crying expert Dieter Wolke, the scientific director of the Jacobs Foundation at Zurich University says:
"You should never leave a baby to cry until they are about six months old, because before that age, they don't have the ability to cry just to get attention, THEY ARE DOING IT FOR A REASON."

All of these things are a good enough reason for me NOT to let my baby cry. I knew when I fell pregnant that I would have to put up with crying and I will carry my baby and nurse him to sleep for the next 3 years if I have to, what you do is up to you.

Laneisa, QLD, 5 kids + baby Flynn 24/02/05

Thank you Laneisa.

Good Luck to you and your baby.

ps - at this stage my child isn't going to remember any of this - THANK GOD!
By using the word abandon - you criticised us - yes you are entitled to your opinion but don't put others down because its not the same as yours.

But expect that if you do you will receive a come back.

Honestly - good luck to you I wish you and your baby health!

Now I think you'll agree - its time to let this topic go!
I also have the same problem as Paula. My son sleeps fantastically thru the night and is awake heaps during the day. He ison formula as I have problems breast feeding and its not themits the way i was built. At first Michael was feedin almost every 3 hours, and sleeping for 30 minutes up for another few hours and the same thing again until about 8 or 9. I had to increase the amount of his formula as I thought he wasnt getting enough aswell, turns out it was not the case. At my last Maternal nurse visit, she told me that he is growing well and is a content and happy baby wich is very true. Each and every child is different and has take as different toll on us, I dont mean that in a bad way either.
With my first son, I never had any of these sleeping problems, but I had heaps of family around as I lived up the street from my mum and Nana, and they rallied around me too, but they didnt smother me. By the time my second son was born, he slept well but cried all the time, even after, change, fed, hugs and kisses and a play. I was told to do control crying, which helped when my Mum and Nan werent around. The one problem I found with them being picked up all the time and walked to sleep or rocked is they never went to sleep in their beds, Then when we moved and they werent so close to come and help who had the problem of putting them to bed.
Now with Bub #3, he has the sleeping problem, I too sometimes put him into bed during the day to have a few minutes to myself, as there are certain things you cant do when bub is in hand. My Mum has come to help so I can ie: do the washing and clean up a bit during the day, as most days i can start things but they dont get finished. Its tough being a Mum, but it is the most rewarding job ever.

Paula I hope Bub sleeping settles down, and congratulation too.


Kathy,VIC,Josh 8, Alex 7, Michael 1

Dear Kathy,

It sounds like #3 child is a bit of a 'high needs' child!! [This is the description that is used by attachment parenting experts for the child that cries a lot and needs to be held and rocked etc]

My 2nd was high needs +++ !! I carried her almost constantly for the first 12-18 months of her life! [but I think nature means us to do that anyway!] Do you have any slings/baby carriers?? These are just the best thing as you can carry baby and have two hands free to do those things that we mums are EXPECTED to do on top of the most damanding job in the world!! like washing cleaning etc!!

There are heaps of different kinds. there is a great site [Wearsthebaby] that has a lot of info on the different types and how to use them:-

There is also another good site - Ask Dr Sears and on there they have

I know it is hard with everyone else's expectations of us!! but try not to stress about the house etc the baby is the most important thing and who cares if the house is a wreck [LOL] so long as your bub is well cared for! Anyone with kids should understand!! A woman once told me her MIL used to say to her "When I come to see you, the house better not be clean and tidy!! I am coming to see you and my new grandchild - NOT the house!" What a great attitude!

By your signature, it looks like bub is still only a month or two old? Congratulations - and here's hoping for some well earned sleep for you soon!


Apologises to everyone to begin with as I have had 3 hours sleep but I have had just about enough of this Bullsh*t

I have been a member of this forum for a long time and have seen many frootloops come and go......

I am sick of coming in here and reading that I am damaging my baby because I am teaching him to sleep.

Thats totally fine if you don't agree with what I do as a parent, but keep your patronising opinions to yourself.

There are lots of positive things about attachment parenting Im sure but there are also things that maybe not so good (in my opinion) however I don't go over to other "alternative" websites telling the participants that they are damaging their children. I doubt any of those parents would put up with it either.

This forum is here to help and support each other - and of course to share our different opinion, we all have so much to learn from each other.

But please pull your heads in - we don't need post after post on numerous subjects preaching the virtures of attachment parenting.

Change the record please!


PS did warn you smile

Steph VIC Mummy to one gorgeous boy

Not getting into this debate, but my dd is now 26 mths old, and is a happy healthy well adjusted little girl whose cognitive development is 6 months advanced for her age.

But, shock horror - I used controlled crying, I routine fed, and I did wrap her and walk away when she was screaming!!!

I was a sole parent from the time she was 3 mths old (and before that for all the help her father gave) and she suffers from severe multiple food allergies so spent a lot of time in hospital. For those who have never been thru the hospital experience with your children (and I hope you never have to), it absolutely destroys any sort of sleep routine you may have had.

My daughter screamed all night every night for 8 weeks after we came home from the hospital. Some nights I would sit and breastfeed her in the dark with tears running down my face, praying that she would sleep because I was so afraid that I might snap and hurt her because I was so exhausted.

I couldn't let my partner deal with her as I didn't have one, so I would change her, feed her and put her in her cot. On the worst nights she would scream for 2 1/2 hours before falling asleep.

Since then, she has slept thru all night every night. Despite being 'abandoned' she loves cuddles and kisses, and trusts me 100%. When she is hurt she always looks for Mama.

I don't think for a second that leaving her to cry has done her any harm. In fact, I think it has helped her to grow independent and secure in her own identity.

Attachment parenting has it's merits, and works well for some people, but out here in th ereal world some of us have committments that mean we simply can't carry our babies 24 hours a day until they are ready to leave home. And some of us just need some sleep!

Mum to Maya Grace 02-03, Sienna & Mercedes 10-06

((((Stephanie & Emmy-Lou))))


Well said my 2 friends!!!
i have to agree i too have used this method and my boy cries really only about once a day at most because he has plenty of sleep. he has independant slept from day one and i really never had to do controlled crying for more than 5 mins if you start off this way then you wont set yourself up for having to rock your baby to sleep. when he is up he gets plenty of love and affection. at 8 weeks he is now sleeping 11 hours a night, and i am a happy mum who is not sleep deprived and does not want to scream at my child i also have a 16 month who i did this with and she is a very well adjusted toddlers who is confident and loving. i think it comes down to different strokes for different folks. we are all different and have many different opinions. maybe we should all meet back here in 18 years and then discuss this further. the proof will be in the pudding so to speak.

Cathy S.A, girl Rylee 07/01/04+Lachlan 03/03/05

Dear Stephanie Sheeesh. Only 3 hours sleep? ... so the sleep training is working for you, then? [sorry - that was uncalled for. I bet there are alot of attachment parent-ers out there having little or no sleep too!] Well, I am pretty new to this Forum and already I am disturbed by the apparent numbers of babies being 'sleep trained' using controlled crying. And that is probably why you see so many posts from me on the subject. I think I should try to make it clear [again] that attachment parenting [including an anti-controlled crying/sleep training understanding] is in NO WAY alternative!! There is a plethora of reasearch, done over the last 50 years giving this a secure scientific basis. Regarding controlled crying, you can read the Australian Association for Infant Mental Health [AAIMHI]'s [NOT 'ALTERNATIVE'] position paper on this - just CLICK HERE. Because of all the positive research into attachment parenting, newly trained health professionals are being educated in it's merits - and some earlier trained professionals are even being retrained. Premie nurseries [NOT 'ALTERNATIVE'] are now routinely encouraging Kangaroo Care [baby-wearing] - so as to reduce infant crying and to improve outcomes for these babies. Maternity Hospitals [NOT 'ALTERNATIVE'] must go through a rigorous program to be accredited as 'Baby Friendly'. Included in the requirements, to attain this much sort after honour, are that babies are not separated from their mothers, they have skin-to-skin contact after delivery and have no restrictions placed on the frequency or length of babies' feeds. All this, and more, is due to the research which forms the basis of attachment parenting. I don't doubt for a minute that parents who do practice CC also love, adore and cherish their children. I know that they are only doing what they think is best and I know they would not do it if they thought it was wrong! That is why I think it it necessary that all be fully informed - and I add links to my posts to REPUTABLE PARENTING SITES!! [also not 'alternative'!!] Dear Emmy-Lou, Though I have a wonderful husband, I often feel like I am doing this job all alone too. He works most nights from 6 pm until anywhere from 8 am to 10 am - and then, of course, he has to get some sleep - I know this isn't as bad as being all alone, but I do understand the sitting up at night bawling because the baby won't sleep [been there,done that]. However, by the time the second one came along, I was much better informed and found that keeping her in bed with me and carrying her during the day was a life saver [maybe for both of us - she was a very vocal little 'treasure'] I don't think I could have survived looking after her and her 'big' brother without attachment parenting and co-sleeping. However, attachment parenting does not necessarily mean that one has to co-sleep or carry one's baby all the time. Why, my own baby is presently sleeping peacefully on her own!! [... but she was parented to sleep by me first smile ] What it does mean, though, is being responsive to a child's cues, following parental instincts, allowing children to be "attached" to their parents - to be as dependent as they need to be, letting them separate from the parent, rather than the other way around - and above all trusting the value of their cries. I know that it is because we all love our children so much, we don't want to hear that we have done anything incorrect or hurtful to them. We all make mistakes [I could go on & on about my own] and thankfully our children DO still love us - but this shouldn't stop us from wanting to seek out more information and learning from our mistakes, and wanting to 'do it better next time' Stephanie is right, there is alot we can learn from one another - but only if we are prepared to listen. jm P.S. Still here ... and still going on and on and on and ....... smile
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